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Julie Shields-Rutyna: [00:00:00] Okay. Welcome everyone. Good evening. My name is Julie Shields and I am the director of college planning education and training at MEFA. And I wanna welcome you to our webinar this evening. How do colleges understand my high school? Oh.

I’ll just go over a couple of logistics. Um, if you have a question during the webinar, use the q and a feature. We’ll use that instead of the chat. If you would like close captioning, you can hit the live transcript button. And if you need to leave the webinar, uh, you can do that at any time. And. You’ll see that this week we will send you the recording and, uh, you’ll have that to be able to review later or share with anyone.

So, um, that will be fine. And then we’re so lucky to have our guest presenter expert tonight, [00:01:00] drew Carter from the College of the Holy Cross. And, uh, drew has a wealth of experience and is really gonna be able to give us the insider view and enlighten us on this topic. And I think most of you know MEFA, uh, if you’re here, but if not, it’s just good to know that MEFA has been around since 1982.

And our mission is to help families plan, save, and pay for college. And so we are here for you, um, throughout the whole college process. Uh, please come back and visit our website often. Uh, look at the webinars we have either coming up live or the ones that are recorded from the past. And you can always give us a call.

Give us an email if you have any questions. Um. Here are all our social media handles. We put lots of information out in these places as well, so feel free to connect with us there. With that, I’m going to get rid of these slides and[00:02:00]

we can begin our conversation. Drew, so. Yeah. This, this is a, a big topic and I know you hear these questions and we do as well, but families always ask, you know, there are so many high schools across the country. How can college admi admissions professionals possibly know and understand all the different high schools and how that.

What is the effect of that in the, in the college admissions process? So maybe you can start us off with, with that. Yeah,

Drew Carter: sure. I mean, it’s one of the, um, it, of all the things that are hard to understand about college admissions, this one seems to be in some ways one of the most prevalent sort of misunderstandings.

Um, and almost disbeliefs, uh, especially when I talk to students, they just can’t believe that we will know. Not [00:03:00] just everything we need to know about their high school. They can’t believe we would know something about their high school. Um, and, and I can remember like that, that sensation, that feeling of being in high school and thinking like, people at these colleges, they just, they, they will have no idea.

Um, and that does, you know, to some extent, um. I think inspire in students and sometimes maybe more parents, um, this sort of need to, to tell like, well, I need to tell you about my high school. I need to tell you about like the, the courses that are available or, um, and the truth is this is. You know, a full-time job for us, you know, it’s 40 plus hours a week.

Um, there are many of us in every admissions office, um, at every college and university around the country. Um, it is a full, uh, full year job for us. It’s a 12 month job and, um, and. But it’s also, it’s not just the human resources. Um, you know, we have, uh, incredible digital resources. We have our own [00:04:00] database of information that we’ve collected from, from years past.

And, um, and, you know, we collect that to create a sort of institutional knowledge. And that’s just one of the small ways in which we’re collecting data on courses available, grading structure. GPA ranges, igpa, rank or grade distribution profile, um, matriculation, statistics, standardized testing, makeup of the community, all the things that colleges and universities and their admissions offices may want to know.

And it does. That brings up an important question. Maybe I should, um, started, maybe we should have started with that, which is, why do we wanna know, you know, like what’s in it for us? And the truth is like understanding the context and the setting in which the student has been studying. Is the most important thing we do.

Um, without that we can’t evaluate their academic work. Um, and this is the [00:05:00] example I use sometimes, Julia. I used this set up at a talk with parents the other night. I say, um, and this is a real, this is a true story. My grandfather, um, who was almost a hundred years old, passed away, um, like two or three years ago.

And, um, we were, he had lived, he lived at home, uh, almost the entire time. And it was the house. Um. He had purchased, um, when he, uh, got married right after World War ii, so you can imagine what he paid for it and what it’s worth now. And um, and we were getting the house ready to put on the market and, um, not surprisingly, this happens in some areas.

Somebody approached us knowing that we were putting the house in the market and said like, well, you know, they wanted to make a cash offer before we put the house in the market. And they were willing to offer us $110,000.

So like the, the question I ask when I do these, these talks and I did the other night, I said like, Julie, [00:06:00] like, do you think that’s a good deal? Do you think we should take it or not? Nope. Yes. Now, I’m guessing you have like five follow up questions, maybe 10 follow up questions, maybe 15 about where’s the house located, how many bedrooms, how many bathrooms, the condition, the zip code, the, you know, what’s the size of the lot?

You know, you’ve got a million questions. Um, well. Let me fast forward here. The, the, the, uh, the zip code is 4 7 3 7 4. It’s Richmond, Indiana. It’s a little tiny ranch, two bedrooms, one bath. Actually. It was a great offer and we took it, you know, like now, ah, you live in eastern Massachusetts. Um, maybe in your neighborhood, Julie, it’s like that is not a good deal, right?

Right. And in most communities here in New England, that would not be a good deal. The point there is that. You know, we all have a sort of working familiarity with, with real estate sometimes you know, about like through [00:07:00] Zillow, you know, houses and information like that. And you get sort of this, this working understanding of like what real estate costs in your location, in your town, and.

That’s essentially the, the information that we are collecting, right? When we’re thinking about a high school, we’re thinking about how many bedrooms, how many bathrooms in the acreage, and all these pieces of information that we need to know to evaluate whether, um, this, the work that, the academic work that the student has done and how that compares to others from other high schools.

It’s a long metaphor, but what it goes to show is that. Our purpose behind knowing high schools is so that we can evaluate fairly, and we have to create that context. And that context is a lot of different data points, and it comes from a million different ways. Um. Maybe we could talk about the different ways in which we collect would this information.

That would

Julie Shields-Rutyna: be great. That would be great. Yeah.

Drew Carter: Um, so it kind of starts, you know, I’ll even start in the early fall. [00:08:00] Like a, a good part of what we do in the early fall is to travel, you know, we’ve, um, every admissions office since there are counselors out around the world, um, to, to meet students in their own communities.

And there is a piece there where we’re getting to know not just the students and sometimes school counselors and creating relationships, but also getting a sense of what the school’s like, and making connections with staff members hopefully. So that, uh, if we have questions down the road, we have a, we have a go-to person.

And so that’s where that sort of research project begins. Um, you know, the second piece is, is, you know, in a sense, when we receive that. That student’s application and the documentation that comes from the high school, um, not just the transcript, but there’s a very important document called the School Profile, um, and an equally important document called, uh, the school Report.

Now, both the school profile and the school reporter filled out by the the counseling department. And sent along [00:09:00] to accompany the transcript that school report it, it gives us information we want. Usually there’s questions there prompted by the common application or the coalition application about, uh, the student’s GPA and the range and the high GPA and, um, you know, with courses are available, levels of courses available, percent of of students going to four year schools.

You know, it’s, it’s questions that have been designed by colleges and universities. Um, and what’s great now is that. Uh, you know, when I started admissions, like I had to go through that and read that and take notes. Now that is automatically downloaded into our system. It automatically populates into the student record.

And so all of the, the key information that we want is pulled right from that school report. The school profile diff, diff, difficult to keep the name separate, but that’s really, um, A PDF that the, the school counseling office designs and personalizes to really talk about their high school at college admissions [00:10:00] officers.

And so that will include some of the same information that. Um, we already saw in the school report, but additional information, it might be, um, might be a complete list of courses available. It might be more information about matriculation, statistics about where those colleges, where those students are going to college, uh, might have information about the makeup of the community and it has contact information for all the school counselors.

It’s really insanely boring to the outside world, but fascinating to us in the admissions world. Um, and if you think of this, like all of these are just layers that we’re creating to, to understand the context and the setting of the work that the student has been doing. Um, and then that then the certain, if we had travel and then we had the school report and the school profile, then sort of maybe additional pieces.

Every college’s own institutional data, right? History of past applicants from that. Um, high school or information that we’ve received from school [00:11:00] reports and school profiles in the past. It is, again, a, a, a many layers of, of institutional data that colleges collect that can help compliment the updated information that we receive every year.

All of this goes to is in the student’s application because it’s connected to the high school or high schools they’ve attended, which is. Automatically coded when the student applies. Again, this has all made so much easier now with digital applications and information just downloading as opposed to when I was reading applications with a number two pencil and taking notes.

Um, and it is a, a little bit of you just, you, you, um. There is an ease that comes with when you’re reading applications because this information is so readily available and readily apparent and you want to understand, you wanna know if that was a good catch offer for that house. You wanna know if is a A or a B, a good grade at this school and what, what are these levels of courses?

What am I seeing? Because, you know, going in [00:12:00] blind just to read in a student’s application. It can be a little discombobulating unless you have that information that will help to create the context in the setting.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Makes so much sense. Yeah. So with all of that in mind, let’s say how, how, it must be a, you have a difficult job, I would say.

How do you evaluate, um, a student’s application from one school that might have 25 advanced placement course choices and a student from another? High school, school that might have three advanced placement choices or none. Uh, that’s, that must be challenging.

Drew Carter: Yeah, I mean, that, that’s a big question we get from students and families and, and a fear in some ways.

And, and what I always first say is that. We don’t punish or reward a student for the school they attend. We look to understand it, understand what’s been available to them for the courses, what’s been available to them, and the grades that [00:13:00] they receive, and then to kind of hold them accountable within that context in that setting.

So, um, and that, and really y you, you almost can’t even group schools. Every school is individual. I mean, from. A school here to five minutes down the road, even if they on the surface would seem to have similar curricular offerings, like we know that at that school, um, students typically would take x as far as an advanced curriculum, and at this school it might be x plus one.

So it. Every school is individual and we would never compare a curriculum of one student at one school versus another student at another school. That just wouldn’t make sense. Um, nevermind the fact that we never compare one student. To another student, you compare one student against the overall pool. Um, but that’s what we do is you, you see like, well, what’s been available to the student as far as courses and levels of [00:14:00] courses, and then what have they done with, with those options.

Um, and then also like what’s, what’s the norm at that school? Because they’re, some schools will limit the, the advanced courses that a student can take in a particular setting limit. Each year or limited by year. Um, so there’s lots of different ways in which we need to understand that information. And I usually say it’s, it’s so much easier than you, you can imagine it is.

Um, not just because we’re asking in advance for the information we need, but for the most part, um, we have that information automatically populated into our system. And so it’s there waiting for us when we start to read the student’s application. But it, but to your point, students are often going onto message boards and saying.

Uh, or reading, let’s just say reading somebody posts, I’m applying to blank college. I’ve got this standardized testing and I’ve taken six AP courses and I got [00:15:00] waitlisted. And a student saying like, well, I’ve only taken two. I guess I’ve got no chance. Well, I would say, well, it depends, you know, it depends on what, what, what high school you attend and what the, what courses have been available to you.

And there’s, you know, you, you hate saying it depends so often, but. It does depend sometimes, and uh, it depends on that context in that setting that we need to understand first.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Yes. Just as an aside, I have a financial aid colleague who wears a, it depends sweatshirt all the, all the time. Uh, can, can you talk a little bit about, um, grade point average weighted unweighted, what that means and how that can be different from school to school to Yeah.

Drew Carter: I mean it’s, it is such a, um, a common question we’ll get at, at larger events, especially like a college fair, A student will come up and say, I’ve got a three point. Whatever GPA what I, and I’m always said, like, I, I don’t really know what that means. Um, every school computes their GPA differently [00:16:00] and, um, about, I’m gonna just estimate about three quarters of colleges.

When a student applies, that admissions office will take that transcript and they will ignore the GPA that’s, that’s accompanied it. And they will, um, break down the transcript and they will create their own GPA using their own institutional formula to sort of standardize the GPA for all the applicants, um, for that particular year.

And, um, you know. Sort of, there’s a popular understanding in most states around the country that, that the state universities usually have a standardized GPA formula that all the state universities need to use and certainly true here, um, in Massachusetts. Um, so about three quarters of the. Colleges will do that.

They will say, we don’t care what you think your GPA is. We’re gonna go ahead and write our own GPA based on courses and grades and things like that. That leaves about a quarter of of colleges out there who will do something differently. Usually [00:17:00] it’s, they might record the GPA just for, um, historical institutional data, but they’ve got a, a different rubric that they’re gonna use to evaluate the grades, um, and especially as it relates to the student’s rigor.

And they’ll do something differently. So I know internally within a high school, nothing is more sort of meaningful and um, easy to understand the student’s, GPA. But once you move outside the walls of that high school. Nothing is less meaningful because every college needs to come to a different way to understand the work that you’ve done and how they can standardize the understanding of those grades, um, especially within that context and that setting.

So, um, it’s, it’s hard, but we, we need to make, we need to all be speaking the same language, and I think that’s what standardizing that GPA review does for some schools and for others, they use some sort of different rubric.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Okay. That can be an

Drew Carter: eye opening. But to your point, I think [00:18:00] I will say I have seen a shift at some schools this year.

They’ve either always been an unweighted GPA and they’ve moved to weighted or they’ve always been weighted and they’ve moved to unweighted. And counselors and students and parents are worried that there’s nothing to worry about whether you’re weighted or unweighted. Whether you’ve changed or you’re the same forever, or whether your school doesn’t do GPAs, that certainly happens at some places.

Um, it’s fine. It’s not gonna hurt you, it’s not gonna advantage you. Schools are gonna evaluate your academic work, likely using their rubric, and, um, and have an understanding. And if there’s been an update. They’ve been notified of the update. It’s present in the application. They’re aware of it, and it’s not gonna impact anyone’s admissions chances for any changes like that.

Okay.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: And you know, I think some people wonder, do, does a student who attends a certain type of high [00:19:00] school have an. Advantage or disadvantage in the admissions process? Someone you know, I’ll give a few examples. Large public schools, small, independent, high schools, charter schools, specialized program schools.

Um, do any of those students, you know, in general have advantages and disadvantages?

Drew Carter: Um, they don’t, and, and most especially because they, for the most part, the, the schools that students attend has been outside of their control. Um, it might be just based on the community that they’re in, the region of the country they’re in.

Um. Family resources. There’s so many things that can impact a student’s enrollment at a school that colleges, um, don’t really punish or reward a student. Also, a, a really common fear is that if lots of students from your high school are applying to one particular college, that that’s gonna be disadvantaged because [00:20:00] colleges don’t wanna enroll too many students from one particular school.

Uh, I remember that I believed that specific urban legend when I was a senior in high school. Um, what I’d like to say about that is that you’re just not giving admissions officers enough credit for being as greedy as we are. We just want the best kids and we don’t care if they all go to the same school.

And why would it make a difference if like some of them went to a school five minutes away? Okay. We just want the best kids. Um, you know that I commonly, there’s a example I use of this. There’s a school that I visit every year, and I think a couple years ago we had about 40 applications from that school.

And I think that year we admitted 39 of them because when you looked at each one individually, they were just that good. And there’s another schoolwide visit. You know, I think a couple years ago we had about 20 applications, and that year we denied all 20 because when you [00:21:00] looked at each one individually.

None of them were that good. And so we’re, we’re evaluating each student individually and we’re not ing rewarding. And if there’s lots of great ones from the same school, great. We want great kids. Because when you get to our campus, you’re lower college. It doesn’t matter what high school you attended anymore, now you’re ours.

So, um, don’t worry. Encourage all your friends to apply to the colleges you’re applying to, like. The more the merrier. Um, especially if they’re all applying to Holy Cross. No, I’m just kidding. Yeah. That, but, but do not, I, and I know I’m, I, I say this every year and I will have to keep saying it every year ’cause this urban legend will never die.

But no, there’s no limits. Um, there’s just, uh, colleges out there looking for the best kids. And if they come, if there’s a bunch of ’em at the same school, then great. That’s awesome for us.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Wow. Yeah. You

Drew Carter: have lots of friends at orientation. [00:22:00]

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Thank you for that. ’cause I, I may have somehow believed in that urban legend little bit.

Sure. So,

Drew Carter: yeah. I mean, it makes sense. It’s, and it is, it has stood the test of time that urban legend is not going away.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Yep. Yep. Can you talk about class rank?

Drew Carter: Sure. I mean, there are many schools out there that do provide a, a specific enumerated class rank for, um, their graduating class. And that information will accompany, um.

The transcript and the, the school report that the counseling office will send to the admissions office. And there are many schools, um, I don’t know if I would say most, but, um, many, um, that don’t do a specific class rank. Um, I. Again, that’s information that, um, whether your school ranks or doesn’t is not gonna punish or, or reward a, a student in their application.

We just, we’ll, we’ll take the information that’s available to us and if it’s not available to us, [00:23:00] we, uh, miss just not a part of the evaluation. Um, some schools will provide some sort of, uh. Grade distribution profile. Some will provide quintiles or deciles, and some schools just give you nothing. They just say, here’s the grades.

Good luck. Um, remembering, you know, colleges have their own institutional data, so sometimes you can, if you have a history of applicants from a school, you have a sense of the range. What’s most important, and it’s, you know, almost most important to say every single time about every single topic is what matters is how does that applicant compare against the pool of applicants this year from years past?

Doesn’t really matter. What matters is that applicant against this pool. So if you’re. 10th in your class and you think there’s nine kids better than you, well that doesn’t matter. What matters is how do you compare against the pool of applicants at that particular college that you’re applying to? [00:24:00] Um, and so yeah, the, the ranks, I know schools seem to be just getting rid of doing a class rank.

I think there’s lots of, um, lots of good reasons to do that, that have nothing to do with college admissions, but whether your school has it or doesn’t. Trust me, it will not impact your chances of getting admitted to college. For sure.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: And you, you spoke about the building, the relationships with different high schools and how you have, you know, you have your group of high schools that you go to maybe each year, um, and.

That sounds so important as far as getting all this information and really understanding the different schools. Uh, and I think you already answered this, but I’ll just have you confirm it. The question would be, is there an advantage then to a student who attends one of those schools that you know so well and have seen other students come from that school do well at Holy Cross?

Um, or probably as I [00:25:00] think I heard you say, um. No, it isn’t you, you know, the schools well, but

Drew Carter: I can, I, I will come to an understanding of creating that setting in context faster. But if it takes me longer, that’s what I’ll do. You know it, and, and I will say there is an excitement and a joy every time of seeing an applicant from high school that I don’t know, I’ve never heard of.

I like, gosh, it’s like a new TV show. It’s something new on Netflix. And, you know, that comes up on my algorithm. Um, I’m like, oh, great. What, you know what? I can, I want us to look at the transcript first and see what it looks like, and then go back to the school profile and see if I can connect here with the.

You know, is it a trimester school or a semester school? And what are the course offerings here? Um, there is an excitement there. It’s a little bit, it’s like a new Sudoku puzzle. You’re like, Ooh, I think I can do this one. Um, and it might take me a little bit longer than those schools I know really well.

But that’s great. There’s a, there’s an excitement to that and. Then [00:26:00] there’s times where things still aren’t clear and that’s when we just reach out. Um, we have to be clear ’cause we have to create that setting in context so that we can evaluate the student and when we can’t. I mean, it’s only November I have read this year so far actually, I, it’s here on my screen.

I’m gonna, I will. Tell you, here you go. Okay. So I’ve read 304 applications so far this year. I have sent, okay. I talked to a school counselor today on the phone for 34 minutes. He told me, he thanked me at the end of the call and said, I’m just looking at my phone right now. We’ve been on the phone for 34 minutes and that was about one applicant.

It was some questions I had and some things that needed to be filled in, um, about their progression through high school. And I have sent and received probably f. Between 30 and 40 emails, email exchanges to school counselors, um, with [00:27:00] questions I had about applicants. Um, and today I sent a Gchat message to one of my coworkers and I said, I can see in this application you’ve already been in contact with the counselor about something about this applicant.

I’ve got another question. Will you just follow up with them? ’cause you’ve already got an open email thread. Um. Because that’s what, that’s what we want to do, is to understand first so that we can evaluate second,

Julie Shields-Rutyna: that insight into how you, you do your job and your, your fellow counselors do their, uh, is, is so valuable, so valuable to just, just, you know, we could get a really good sense of this process and what’s going on for all of you, um, in terms fall, winter.

Thank you. So sometimes

Drew Carter: the questions. Um, you know, like sometimes you, you take a quick little look at the school’s website and you say like, oh, I don’t know if they, if they have a, a list, they have all their course offerings here, I have a question about something and, oh, I can find their whole course catalog here.

Great. There’s my answer. And then sometimes it’s as [00:28:00] easy as a phone call or email. And you know what, like your school counselor’s brand new and they don’t know you that well. That’s okay. Like, that’s totally fine. It happens all the time. And we’ll still get the information we need, um, or your counselor’s out on maternity leave.

Totally fine. Totally fine. We’ll talk to that director of counseling. We’ll talk to that, um, administrative assistant. We’ll get a different counselor, uh, who can explain the curriculum to us. We will find the information that we need. It’s, it’s like, it’s like an ingredient for a cake. Like we’re gonna, we’re gonna get to the right store to get that right ingredients that we can bake our cake.

Um, and it’s actually not, not as hard as you think. And there is a little bit of a excitement and joy of like that puzzle that we’re piecing together. Mm-hmm. And it happens a lot, fa, I mean, it happens so much faster than you think because it’s, um. [00:29:00] In similar ways. You know, when we, when we all go to get our taxes done in the new year, sometimes that tax accountant takes your stuff and then boom, they, they take care of everything.

They do your taxes and it’s done. And you’re like, how did that happen so fast? And sometimes they come back to you with three questions. I see that blank. But what I don’t understand is x and y. Oh, I’m, there’s one other question I had. Did you blank this year? Um. In the end, you’re like, my gosh, how did they do it so fast?

Well, it’s just what they do. They do it all day, every day, and they know the questions that they’re looking for, and they know if they have no questions. And in some ways we’re the same except our tech season starts in September or October and goes all the way, usually every year until March or April.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Yeah. Now we know academics are number one, super important, but what about the differences at, at different high schools as far as sports and activities and [00:30:00] clubs and that some, some schools have everything and so many offerings and some don’t have as many. Um, can you just talk about how, how that could affect, um, an evaluation or the admissions process for a student?

Drew Carter: Yeah. I think for, for most of my career, I. It has been the case until the pandemic and then once the pandemic came and since then it has absolutely been the case. Colleges they don’t, I’m I’m, hang with me ’cause I’m gonna say something controversial and maybe, you know what I’m gonna say? They don’t care what you do in your free time.

Yeah. They care that you do in your free time. But which specific thing they’re not. Adding points to your application because you’ve done X as opposed to Y. They don’t think that student government is better than a job at CVS. They don’t think French Club is better than lacrosse. They think something is better than [00:31:00] nothing.

And part of that is this understanding that we know all opportunities aren’t equal. Some students go to schools where there’s 8 million clubs and activities and leadership opportunities available for anyone who wants it. And other students go to school with much fewer options. Other students go to schools with no options.

Uh, other students go to schools where there are options, but not options for them because they gotta go home every day and get their little sister off the bus and then get their little brother off the bus and they’ve gotta babysit until their parents get home. So. After school activities is not an option for them.

We know all opportunities are available for everyone and they’re not equal. So what’s important is that, um, you know, you find a voice in the application process to, to say the things you’ve done, whether they’re official school activities or official out of school activities, or even unofficial out of school activities like family responsibilities or hobbies.

Colleges will look to understand [00:32:00] that piece so that they can have an image of what your experience in high school has been, but not. They’re not looking to say, you’ve been better than this other person, or This other person’s been better than you because you’ve done X, but they’ve done Y. That’s not really what it is.

And the other thing I’ll say here is that the ways in which you’ve been engaged outside of the classroom really bleeds throughout your application. It might be something that your counselor talks about in their recommendation. It might be something you talk about in an essay or in a supplemental essay or even an interview.

So. I think students have this image that we go through their resume and you know, assign white values to things when that’s just really not the case. It does help. It helps bring the black and white application into color as we learn about your involvement outside of the classroom. But it’s not a way in which we’re really separating applicants from each other in the pool.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: That’s very important. Yeah. [00:33:00] So I’ll ask, I’ll ask one more question and if you have any questions that you would like, uh, drew to answer that he hasn’t covered, put them in the q and A. But my last question to you, drew, is, is there anything that the students can do to make sure that their application, you know, accurately reflects the context of their, of their high school?

Drew Carter: Sure. I mean, the, the two things I usually mention is, number one, um, to the best of your ability, and this really depends upon where you go to school to the best of your ability. Um, try to get to know your school counselor if that’s an option. Now you go to a public school in California and your counselor has a, a, uh, counseling load of, of 600 students.

That’s gonna be a little more difficult. Um, maybe you have to get to know them over email. Um, but, and I say that because the best counselor recommendations usually come in the situation where the counselor knows the student and really the student [00:34:00] has allowed the counselor to get to know them. Um, so that’s the first thing I’d say if, if that’s an option for you, try to get to know your counselor.

And then the last thing is that on the common application, there’s a, a section at the very end called additional information. Now. In most cases that that, um, section of the application should be blank because there’s no additional information that needs to be provided. It’s an optional section, but it is there.

Um, I can’t remember what the prompt says there, but if there’s any additional information, you need the admissions office to know about your application, that’s the option. That’s the place where in, in very brief explanation, you might say to the admissions office. I had a concussion sophomore year. I’d missed significant school time.

And I missed 14 days of, of school classes and my grades did dip a little bit during second quarter, and that impacted the, my midterm grades or something like that. It’s an option to say it. That’s a [00:35:00] location where you might say, um. I had really hoped to take, um, advanced level French senior year.

Unfortunately, it was offered at the same time as advanced level biology. And while I, and my intention is to be a biology major in college, so I’m missing an advanced level language class my senior year, but it’s only a scheduling issue. Um, these, if, if you provide an explanation in this section, it should be brief.

It should be like. 150 words maximum. And um, and for the most part, I actually think most applications don’t need that additional information, but in some cases it makes sense. Um, and that’s a good set, that’s a good place to put that information. But understand that the admissions officers are gonna just be really skimming through that, that area.

So be brief, be to the point, and be gone with your information there.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: That’s super helpful. I don’t see any questions. Um, [00:36:00] that’s because I think you just provided so much good information. Uh, we can wait one moment and while we are, um, anything Yeah, any parting words, anything you wanna end with on this topic?

Drew Carter: I think, um, the only other thing I’d say is I think I, I, I think this is for the most part the case that students go into their senior year of high school. Excited about college. But of course, like they have this level of like pride in their own high school. And then sometimes they get to that admissions process and then all of a sudden they feel like, oh, but the high school I’ve gone to has disadvantaged me in some way because of X, Y, or Z.

And I hope you’ve heard my words and say it hasn’t. Like your high school has not disadvantaged you in any way. Nobody has advantaged or disadvantaged in the college admissions process based on the school they attend. Um. We, there’s a, a baseline level of fairness that colleges seek to, to [00:37:00] create, and a big part of that is in treating students equally regardless of the school that they attend.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: That’s good information. I do have a few questions. Um, so someone asked, what if my counselor isn’t the greatest with communication and not very active in the school? This person is having a hard time creating a relationship with the counselor. Any, any advice there?

Drew Carter: Yeah, it, it, um, is, it is probably more common than uncommon, right?

We’re getting applications from. Outside of the US where college counselors or guidance counselors, that that’s not a role in many, um, countries. So, um, and even certain, like I was mentioning different parts of, of the United States where the counselor to student ratio is like so extreme that um, it’s probably even becoming more uncommon than common where.

The counselor, the school counselor has a really firm grasp over, um, over the [00:38:00] student and their profile and can really help in the admissions process. Um, so certainly again, you’re not disadvantaged in any way. Again, I, I think it’s just an opportunity to, um, to. To do everything you can do to engage thoughtfully in the college search process and in the admissions process.

If schools give the opportunity to write supplemental essays, then you’ll wanna be real thoughtful about what you’re writing there so you can show more of yourself. And schools give the opportunity to have a, an admissions interview. It’s certainly something to take advantage of so that more of your personality come forward.

So it’s not anything to be discouraged by, but um, certainly something to be thoughtful about as you. As you navigate the admissions process.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Thank you. And how do colleges feel about immersive language programs?

Drew Carter: Yeah, I mean, I wish I lived in a town that had one so that my kids could, could be in one. Um, I think they’re, I mean personally, this is just personal bias.

I think they’re really cool. Um, professionally. [00:39:00] Um, we do seek to understand them. Um, so that, that for me, um, whether it’s one on the South Shore or there’s the, the one out in Western Mass, um, I would seek to do a little bit more reading about, um, when that started. Um, did the students start in that immersive language program in kindergarten and they started in ninth grade?

Um. And what, uh, how much of their, their school day has been closed with this immersive language program. Um, what were the options for being up in that program or not, and how did that affect, you know, course offerings? So, uh, I mean, personally I think it’s cool, but professionally I don’t get to have an opinion like that.

I just look to understand it so that I can evaluate the, the academic profile of the student.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: And lastly, this is, this is one of the age old questions as well. Um mm-hmm. Should students prioritize high level classes like AP or dual enrollment [00:40:00] versus keeping their GPA the highest?

Drew Carter: Yeah. I mean there’s, uh, I need that.

It depends. Sweatshirt. Um, mm-hmm. The most important things are that the student is, um. Feeling engaged in the classroom. They’re feeling challenged, they’re finding a certain level of success, and they’re doing so while, uh, maintaining physical and mental health and wellbeing. So there’s a lot of things there that it depends upon, but that whole package can say like, okay, well, um.

We could move up and maintain all those things. Or, or actually, no, we could, we should stay right here to maintain all those things. Um, to some degree, like, um, that is a conversation that the, you know, the student and the family can have. If there’s a representative from the school, whether it’s a counselor or an assistant principal, that’s, that could be somebody to loop in.

Um, there are [00:41:00] times I think that. Um, I also, I just do, I wanna reject the premise that, well, if you take a higher level class, you get a worse grade. Yep. Like maybe. Also, guess what? Maybe not. Um, sometimes the, the rising tide lifts all boats, right? Like getting in that classroom with a, that’s at a higher level.

Um, sometimes you’re surrounded by, um, you know, really motivated, inspiring students sometimes that that instructor in that classroom is motivating and inspiring. Sometimes that that raises all the votes. I, I reject the premise that you automatically get a worse grade. Um, but I think most important is that the student is, is feeling alive in the classroom and that they’re, they’re feeling a sense of challenge while finding some level of success and then maintaining physical and mental health and wellbeing.

Um, it’s a. It’s a little complicated equation there, [00:42:00] um, and one that I think, uh, uh, parents and students should have some input and hopefully a representative from the school could have some input as well.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Love that. Drew, thank you so much for all of this, and thank you all for your questions. And I think I didn’t mention this at the beginning that, um, this is the second of three conversations that I’m gonna be having with Drew this fall now.

So there’ll be another in December and you can go back and listen to the first, um, that’s recorded on our website as well. So, um, thank you. What’s our topic

Drew Carter: for December? Julie, do you remember? December

Julie Shields-Rutyna: is, um, what do admissions. Officers really, um, think about when they’re reading applications.

Drew Carter: Oh, sounds like a good one.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Yeah, it does. I can’t wait. I can’t wait to hear

Drew Carter: it.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: You’re gonna tell us all the secrets.

Drew Carter: That’s a good, I will say that’s a good time of year for it because, or right in the, in the thick of it right [00:43:00] now. So that’s a great time to, to ask that question. I’ll tell you exactly what I’m thinking. You’re not gonna record it though, are you?

Julie Shields-Rutyna: We are.

Drew Carter: Okay. Alright. I’ll still, you know me, I’m an open book, so

Julie Shields-Rutyna: I love that. And the first one I’ll, I’ll say is, uh, was about how do you get started in this process. Um, so go back and watch that one if you haven’t as well. True. Thank you. Thank you all.

Drew Carter: Okay. Thanks Julie. Thanks everybody.

Julie Shields-Rutyna: Bye.